Saturday, December 30, 2017

Message to the Sunken Place



Dear Black Republicans,

You support an earlier observation of mine, that Blacks have never had a problem building wealth. There were wealthy free Blacks during the very heart of the slavery era. The problem is that were it not for racism, MORE Blacks would be wealthy, and poverty among our communities would actually be rare, but we've been prevented from building legacy wealth over the generations. Our wealth has been continuously siphoned off -- our property STOLEN -- and used to feed the hoarded money bins of the dominant class of our racist aristocracy (which explains where the "lazy" stereotype comes from, as whites encourage you to continue to "work twice as hard as anyone else" since you are supporting your household AND his). When I point this fact out, you keep coming to refute it using your individual success story as the proof that there is no racism, or that it's "not really a big factor." The facts of history demonstrate that you will need something stronger as proof. What do you have?

Throw Down Your Rod!

~M. Rasheed

___________________________________

Honda to pay $25M for overcharging minority buyers on loans

How Toyota May Have Started Overcharging Minority Customers

Justice Department, CFPB Say Mortgage Lender Overcharged African-American and Hispanic Borrowers

U.S. Government Uses Race Test for $80 Million in Payments

Survey Finds Insurance Companies Charge Black Drivers Living in Predominately African-American Neighborhoods 70% More for Auto Insurance

City Council alert: Fifth Third Bank hiked interest rates on minority customers

Wells Fargo Deliberately Pushed Dangerous Loans On Blacks, Hispanics: Lawsuit

Feds: BancorpSouth illegally denied black consumers fair access to mortgages

Just FOUR Home Loans Were Given To African-Americans In This Major City In A Whole Year

Credit Card Debt’s Mighty Grip on Black America

5 Big Companies Sued for Racial Discrimination

‘I Put in White Tenants’: The Grim, Racist (and Likely Illegal) Methods of One Brooklyn Landlord

Hasidic neighborhood in South Williamsburg is a top beneficiary of Section 8, but some question whether law is strictly followed

Just as I Suspected, Paying Rent Is Racist

[INTERVIEW] Richard Rothstein "The Color of Law"

BOSTON. RACISM. IMAGE. REALITY.

That was no typo: The median net worth of black Bostonians really is $8

[REVIEW] The History Thieves by Ian Cobain – how Britain covered up its imperial crimes

The Case for Reparations

Black Workers Really Do Need to Be Twice as Good

Wednesday, December 27, 2017

Racism is Theft: The Deliberate Widening of the Racial Wealth Gap



Justice Department, CFPB Say Mortgage Lender Overcharged African-American and Hispanic Borrowers

U.S. Government Uses Race Test for $80 Million in Payments

‘I Put in White Tenants’: The Grim, Racist (and Likely Illegal) Methods of One Brooklyn Landlord

Hasidic neighborhood in South Williamsburg is a top beneficiary of Section 8, but some question whether law is strictly followed

Honda to pay $25M for overcharging minority buyers on loans

How Toyota May Have Started Overcharging Minority Customers

Survey Finds Insurance Companies Charge Black Drivers Living in Predominately African-American Neighborhoods 70% More for Auto Insurance

City Council alert: Fifth Third Bank hiked interest rates on minority customers

Wells Fargo Deliberately Pushed Dangerous Loans On Blacks, Hispanics: Lawsuit

Feds: BancorpSouth illegally denied black consumers fair access to mortgages

Just FOUR Home Loans Were Given To African-Americans In This Major City In A Whole Year

Credit Card Debt’s Mighty Grip on Black America

5 Big Companies Sued for Racial Discrimination

*************************************

Q"Is our society wrongly declaring certain things as racist that are not racist?"

Muhammad Rasheed - Yes, the dominant class of the United State’s racist aristocracy (and their subjugated and indoctrinated supporters) has been labeling those who criticize racism as racists themselves, generally for no other reason than because they talk about the issue and make whites uncomfortable in the telling.

To pull this off, it’s necessary for the racist to attempt to redefine the meaning of “racism,” so that they may play victim and avoid accountability for their willing support of a system designed to economically build them up at the expense of others. The entire point of racism and why it exists, comes from targeting Black people for subjugation, exploitation, and the plundering of their wealth. The justification for doing so has created a surface-level ideology supported by the oppressor class, that pretends Blacks are inferior beings. The latter would not exist without the former, and the former defines to the smallest degree the race issue in the United States. To decree that the prejudiced/bigoted feelings of a racist are divorced from the white race’s never-ending history of exploiting Black people for profit, and is all that encompasses the definition of racism, is a fiction.

It benefits the racist for the oppressed to never fight the oppression — to never even bring the topic up — enabling the racist aristocracy to enjoy their plundered loot unopposed. Therefore, the dominant class has created the idea that those who bring the topic to the forefront of the national conscious in order to fight for the long over-due righting of traditional Western wrongs are themselves racists (“reverse racism”) in order to get them to shut up.

Michael Mc Laughlin - I think that a lot of what you say is true, but I think the American focus on race is divisive. I was really shocked when I went to see a doctor in the US and had to fill out a form asking what race I was. In Ireland that would be illegal. I think you guys are too focused on it. I do not think it is healthy. We are all the same. Why all this pretence that their is something fundamentally different? I don’t buy it. Do you?

Muhammad Rasheed - Hi, Michael. The issue isn’t whether l personally buy it or not. The problem that we deal with here is that the root cause of racism —the exploitation and plundering of Blacks by the white dominant class creating the infamous wealth gap—never stopped. This is the source of the racial divide you’ve mentioned.

If Black people don’t bring the topic up in efforts to finally cure our society of the wrong, it will never be addressed at all, since the white dominant class benefits from just leaving the oppressive social contract in its current anti-Black state.

Your suggestion that l should just leave the topic alone is fundamentally unjust.

Fel Rouse - There’s no question this has been done and is often the meaning behind the phrase “playing the race card.” The response to that accusation is rarely heard: “since you’re dealing the race card, I’m playing it. I play the hand I’m dealt.”

But we should never allow the idea that race governs everything in the lives of black people. It can only do that if we allow it to go unchallenged when it arises, or if we bring up race in situations where it isn’t related to the situation we’re facing. As a black man, I refuse to be limited by anyone-that to me is the meaning of freedom. Along with that is my refusal to limit anyone else. If race is an element in some situation I get into I definitely confront it. But if it’s not there, and a lot of times it isn’t, I’m not going to bring it up because it doesn’t occur to me to do so.

Muhammad Rasheed - Hi, Fel. Thanks for responding.

Our quality of life as Black Americans revolves around economics in a country with a capitalist tradition. Along side that tradition is another, more nefarious tradition, which has involved the plundering of our wealth, preventing us from building legacy wealth over generations, which is responsible for the ever-widening wealth gap between the two races. Whites have deliberately kept us away from wealth building opportunities they made available for themselves, while charging us higher fees and taxes. The nature of racism is theft, and the bigotry and prejudiced attitudes is how they justify that theft.

Racism touches every aspect of our lives whether we are conscious of it or not. We all need to be in that fight so it can finally stop. We are at war.

(see: list of plundering of the Black community articles linked above)

Fel Rouse - Yes, this is an old tradition. But there is a piece that you have not included. That is black American participation in this process. Credit card debt doesn’t have to be so rampant among our communities if we get wise about our spending habits. We can seek to do business with minority owned firms and institutions instead of leaving our communities to shop and conduct business. We can make it hot for any politician supposedly representing us and our communities locally, on the state level, and nationally. We can volunteer in schools and demand that school administrators include education on consumer economics, the trades, and consumer mathematics. And we can demand that our churches take a seriously proactive role in monitoring and improving conditions in our communities. Where I live, too little of that is being done by black people when it is done at all. You might see it as a war, but what it truly is is brainwashed people who have to learn to come away from a lifestyle that is ego and desire driven. There is little that 14–15% of the population can do in a war against 75% of the population unless they develop a strong awareness and discipline in thought an behavior. I have been learning about a man named Umar Johnson and I have been sadly unsurprised to see how this person convinced black Americans to donate thousands, if not hundreds of thousands to him for a school he has no plans to establish. My own former congressman Chaka Fatah now languishes in prison after having let our communities decline economically, socially, and politically for decades. And for those decades our people voted for him because he was the name they recognized, period. We have work to do in our communities first. It will not be easy, it won’t be dramatic, and it won’t be accomplished with marches, speechifying, and news cameras. Are you in?

Muhammad Rasheed - To be honest, I’ve strongly disagreed with too much within these two posts of yours to trust your “Are you in?” offer. I would fully expect to get my throat cut while my back was turned. lol

Every time you’d type the word “but,” I’d wince as it would immediately be followed by something from my ideological enemy’s political talking points script.

Fel Rouse - Get your throat cut?

Okay now I understand your point of view. Your ideological enemy is black Americans themselves, especially those who don’t completely accept your version of reality. Next I suppose you’ll try to categorize me as some sort of Judas to black people’s aspirations. I have met quite a few guys who believe they have the only and best view for the liberation of our people from oppression. Every one of them has only served to produce an even more confining vision of black life in America, and not one of them has done a thing to improve conditions for our people. You might be one of those kinds of guys, you might not. What is definite is that it will take a whole lot more than graphic novels to overcome the challenges we face. Peace.

Muhammad Rasheed - It will no doubt take more than my cartoons alone to free us, and it’ll certainly take more than downplaying the racism to deflect towards victim blaming as well.

Blacks have never had a problem building wealth and working hard, etc. It’s our ability to keep the fruits of our labor, own our own communities, and build legacy over generations that has been deliberately sabotaged by greedy outsiders who are currently pretending “not to see color.” There are varying tools at our disposal that can empower us, but using them effectively will lead to one certain outcome: We will be physically attacked by frustrated whites, fearful that their racism gravy train will stop. My people need to be armed with that knowledge, too. We are at war, it is NOT their fault, and to be “in” will encompass far more than telling them to stop letting whites plunder them using credit card scams.

There’s only one way to improve conditions for our people. That’s to weaponize our spending power with a nation-wide boycott, spending only on Black businesses, and then arm ourselves in defense for the certainty of American Civil War 2.0.

Laniyia Washington - M. Rasheed wrote: "There’s only one way to improve conditions for our people. That’s to weaponize our spending power with a nation-wide boycott, spending only on Black businesses, and then arm ourselves in defense for the certainty of American Civil War 2.0."

You think the people at the top give a damn about any color other than green? They screw over blacks, whites, browns, yellows and reds, race is just another excuse to do it like religion used to be and still is in some cases.

So here is the reality.

Some blacks will join the white billionaires and proceed to piss all over the poor, the black, white, brown, yellow and red poor.

In fact plenty already do and always have, before blacks and whites met blacks exploited and enslaved other blacks and whites exploited and enslaved other whites.

Look out your window and wake up to the fact that its going on already all around you, blacks murdering and killin each other, robbing and stealing, exploiting and oppressing ourselves.

You think black run businesses are not gonna do what those white businesses you listed did when it makes them more money?

Look at Baltimore.

63% black population a majority.

Black mayors for years, black leaders of the city council and black police chiefs and a majority black and other minority police force.

And just as corrupt as places whites are the majority with the black people in power doing what people in power always do.

There will never be a time we become what you describe, it is a childish fantasy that ignores human nature. The moment i grew out of believing such nonsense and began making my own way along my own path was the day i became free from racism.

But go ahead wait for your fantasy to happen instead and live in chains of your own making.

Muhammad Rasheed - Hi, Laniyia. Thank you for your feedback. I appreciate it a great deal.

I have little choice but to live my life and to live my own path, primarily since l enjoy eating, having shelter from the elements, and the cartooning craft of my chosen field. I can strive along my personal pursuit of happiness while l do my small part to fight for Black Empowerment and Economic Inclusion within the country of my birth.

I happen to believe that my people’s securing of full citizenship, and finally winning free of the greedy clutches of whites and their subjugated minions, is a fight worth the effort, even if l don’t live to see it happen myself. Freedom is always worth fighting for—no matter the odds—since it is indeed a Righteous Fight.

It is our duty to fight for freedom, yet it is the mindset of the treacherous blacks who support my enemy that the battle is too great, the odds too overwhelming. I, for one, am proud to not be of that class of cowards.

Laniyia Washington - How will you know you are free of greedy white clutches when greedy black clutches are identical and have a identical effect?

M. Rasheed wrote: "It is our duty to fight for freedom, yet it is the mindset of the treacherous blacks who support my enemy that the battle is too great, the odds too overwhelming. I, for one, am proud to not be of that class of cowards."

Think about this for a second.

Who is it that thinks the enemy is so powerful that it needs all blacks to rise up en masse and weaponize our spending power to defeat it?

Who is it that thinks the odds are so overwhelming that a nation wide boycott is required?

I do not think that, i think its weak and easily defeated because it could not stop me from achieving success.

Its a phantom similar to the kind children tell each other stories about in the dark only this ghost story is told by adults who imbue it with vast powers only all blacks rising up and working together can overcome.

Just look at your imagined monster, that you imbued with such power it requires a race achieving the impossible to be defeated.

Yet was bitch slapped out of the way by this 47 year old black tranny.

When you become obsessed with the enemy, you become the enemy.

Muhammad Rasheed - lol Hi again, Laniyia.

My argument doesn’t feel as if it had been “bitch slapped” as you say, since a goodly portion of your own counter was composed of strawman effigies that I don’t believe in anyway.

By no means do I think that a literal “ALL” Blacks need to come together for the boycott, just as not all Blacks in the African-American community need to work together in order for us to have a powerful political bloc to hold our elected officials accountable.

It didn’t take all the slaves to engage in violent uprisings, running away to freedom, or passionately fighting for the abolitionist cause, but the quality people who did perform in this way was enough to shake the barbaric racial contract to its core.

It didn’t take all the slaves to bear arms during the Civil War to beat back the greed-fueled enemy, but the quality of the brave men and women who did fight was enough to grant us the rudimentary freedoms we enjoy today.

It didn’t take all the Blacks to engage in sit-in demonstrations, marches, and mountains of paperwork to finally end jim crow and achieve the signing of the 1964 Civil Rights Act, but the dedicated quality men and women who did throw their considerable force and passion behind that fight was more than enough.

I hope for all Blacks to join this fight, it is true, but I do like to think I hold at least a bit of realism with my Hope. lol If I call on the ALL, perhaps I can win through to the fiery and powerful SOME that can be called once again to our great task of being finally, fully FREE.

Once again I thank you for your feedback. You’ve been a delight.

Laniyia Washington - M. Rasheed wrote: "My argument doesn’t feel as if it had been “bitch slapped” as you say, since a goodly portion of your own counter was composed of strawman effigies that I don’t believe in anyway."

I was not referring to your argument i was referring to the monster you think that cannot be defeated by anything but a mass uprising.

And i used your words to describe it not strawmen.

M. Rasheed wrote: "By no means do I think that a literal 'ALL' Blacks need to come together for the boycott, just as not all Blacks in the African-American community need to work together in order for us to have a powerful political bloc to hold our elected officials accountable."

They do not give a crap about what virtually all white voters want other than the few billionaire special interests so why would they care about a minority voting block?

They play identity politics, keep people thinking along racial lines, making us feel dependent on them, all to prevent us from realizing that it is they who are the true enemy.

Here is a bit of historical fact that is rarely mentioned.

In the USA within a generation of being newly emancipated slaves, half of that group went from illiterate to literate. That is a feat no other group of people to have existed on this planet before or since has accomplished in the same time frame.

I do not know about you but that lifts me every time i read it.

Here is the disappointing part.

Fast forward nearly 150 years to today and in many urban areas primarily populated with the descendants of those newly emancipated there is up to a 75% high school dropout rate.

Think about that for a second.

Muhammad Rasheed - Laniyia wrote: “…so why would they care about a minority voting block?”

Well, right now they wouldn’t. I’m saying that it wouldn’t take a whole lot to get them to be accountable, just like in my other examples. Just a dedicated ”some” would do. To reach and recruit that ‘some’ we need to talk to the ‘ALL.’

Laniyia wrote: “…half of that group went from illiterate to literate.”

I’m aware; I often use that same factoid to boast of my people’s power myself. What you have done here is give me yet another reason to slowly shake my head at your proudly displayed, bitch-slappin’ pessimism. If we want it, we can make things happen, Laniyia. God willing. All we have to do is do it.

Laniyia Washington - I do not think im a pessimist i am very pissed.

If i can go from where i started to where i am without the great white racist system beast preventing me or even slowing me much i do not see why others cannot do the same better or even a bit worse but still improve.

That is my reality and i did not need a uprising or a boycott.

Nobody expects everybody to get to the top of the ladder like Obama did but there is no excuse not to get up it a rung or two, and for some maybe a few more.

That is how a people build themselves and it requires no handouts or mass uprisings.

The foundations have been laid and we are standing on the shoulders of giants who laid them yet all i hear is complaining about how hard things are now by people who find it easier to give up than to achieve anything.

They point back in history at those newly emancipated slaves not to honor them, not to be inspired or empowered no. They look back in SELFpity ignoring that amazing achievement preferring to see those amazing people prior to emancipation and lay that they suffer a similar fate.

We aint so different i just didn't want or need to wait around for the rest of you.

Muhammad Rasheed - Okay, I see where our miscommunication breakdowns lay. None of my argument is about an individual’s tract to success (though there is some obvious spill over from the list of plunder articles I linked above), and whether focus, hard work, training, and patient perseverance will work for us as Black people. Of course it will… we’ve never had a problem building wealth. That’s not my issue. OUR issue.

Here. Do me a favor and read this very quick article, and then come back and tell me what your honest take away is.

Detroit’s plan for ‘African Town’ stirs racial tensions

Laniyia Washington - I think it was a stupid idea, its tokenism that at best does nothing to solve the issues and at worst simply exacerbates and disguises the real problems.

Chinatown's and Little Italy's did not need government handouts to be created the people did it themselves. They put their own blood sweat and tears into creating a place and that gave it value to them, it gave them the pride that comes with achieving a goal and knowing it truly belonged to them.

You think a place paid for by others for blacks is ever going to be treated with respect by blacks in the way it would be had it been built by the community itself, even if black contractors are used?

The place would be wrecked robbed and likely burned down the first time CNN spin doctors a police shooting of a black to get ratings. Its not truly the communities creation its a symbol of what the community could not do alone even though other demographics managed it.

It gives me no joy to bring this up but when i came up with the idea for my business i was a whore working the worst part of Harlem in order to pay for the drugs i needed to transition. I learned what i needed to know from local libraries and put together a step by step plan to make it happen.

Can you guess what the very first step was before even considering taking any other steps?

Getting the hell away from and starting it any place other than a poor black community. It was a absolute necessity and above all, above racism and identity politics and all of it that is OUR issue as you put it.

That fact saddens me more than i can properly express.

I do not know if this is the reply you expected wanted or agree with but its what i got.

Muhammad Rasheed - I'm more than satisfied with you comfortably expressing your truth, as well as your honest take away from the article. It is very insightful and helps me fill in puzzle pieces within my own knowledge base in general with how the various tribes within the Black Nation see the world, as well as helps me see where you are coming from in this particular topic. Thank you so much for your time; it' part of why engaging with you here has been so positive.

Now if you are still willing, please skim through these articles below, and give me your honest take away regarding the concept in general, and particularly compared to what you said about the 'China Town' and 'Italy Town' histories you've mentioned.

Atlanta race riot

Tulsa race riot

Chicago race riot of 1919

Rosewood massacre

Red Summer

Springfield race riot of 1908

New York City draft riots

East St. Louis riots

Laniyia wrote: "It gives me no joy to bring this up but when i came up with the idea for my business i was a whore working the worst part of Harlem in order to pay for the drugs i needed to transition. I learned what i needed to know from local libraries and put together a step by step plan to make it happen."

I think it's awesome that instead of lying down and becoming a statistic, that you got up and took hold of the reigns of your life and guided it to the quality you dreamed for yourself. I would NEVER be mad at that, especially for one such as you, loathe as you may be to see me indulge further in racial "identity politics."  lol (Although thus far, you certainly don't seem shy about expressing the 'identity politics of your own tribe.)

I do note, Laniyia, that in order to get the seed money for this venture, you admitted that you had to go off-grid, and use the illegal 'street' methods to attain funds. Aside from the high-physical risk, from the finance side of things that was actually a great advantage for you. How much more difficult would your path have been, and how much more longer would it have taken, were you to have gone through the "legit" routes touted by the deceitful "Stop breaking the law, snowflake! BOOTSTRAPS!" crowd? This is what the "legit" route looks like: (seelist of plundering of the Black community articles linked above)

Laniyia wrote: "It was a absolute necessity and above all, above racism and identity politics and all of it that is OUR issue as you put it."

Hm. There is no "above racism" in America. The best you can do at this time is assimilate into it and wear economic goggles that carefully select out what you don't care to look at. Those you've left behind in Harlem currently cannot afford such equipment. Of course they can at any time choose to do what you've done, but it isn't their fault their community looks the way it does. This is by design.

Laniyia Washington - M. Rasheed wrote: "I'm more than satisfied with you comfortably expressing your truth, as well as your honest take away from the article. It is very insightful and helps me fill in puzzle pieces within my own knowledge base in general with how the various tribes within the Black Nation see the world..."

I am neither part of any black tribe or black nation nor will i ever be.

M. Rasheed wrote: "Hm. There is no 'above racism' in America."

Nor for you because race to you is all as per your comment above.

For me and many others who will never be part of a black nation or tribe there is individuality.

M. Rasheed wrote: "Now if you are still willing, please skim through these articles below, and give me your honest take away regarding the concept in general, and particularly compared to what you said about the 'China Town' and 'Italy Town' histories you've mentioned."

My opinion is they are history.

M. Rasheed wrote: "I do note, Laniyia, that in order to get the seed money for this venture, you admitted that you had to go off-grid, and use the illegal 'street' methods to attain funds."

No i did not i said i did it to pay for the drugs i needed to transition.

I got a loan to start my business.

M. Rasheed wrote: "The best you can do at this time is assimilate into it and wear economic goggles that carefully select out what you don't care to look at. Those you've left behind in Harlem currently cannot afford such equipment. Of course they can at any time choose to do what you've done, but it isn't their fault their community looks the way it does. This is by design."

I left because those who i knew that heard i had a idea asked me about it in order to try and steal it and i left because had i built it there i would have been robbed and ruined by that “tribe”.

Muhammad Rasheed - Laniyia wrote: "I am neither part of any black tribe or black nation nor will i ever be."

lol That proclamation centers you firmly within a sub-group Black Tribe that I argue with all the time. I take it that you have done the following:

1) taken ownership of the concept "surround yourself by the people who are doing what you want to do" or something similar.

2) associate all Black people with ‘poor criminality.’

Couldn't you find some successful Black trans-folk to hang out with? My "former" brother-in-law (he-turned-she) is one. I'm positive there are more. I'm not sure if the extreme position you've taken was entirely necessary in order for you to attain the life you wanted. Thoughts?

Laniyia wrote: "Nor for you because race to you is all as per your comment above."

The white/Black dynamic is 100% the racism relationship of whites exploiting Blacks. It's been like that since 1619 and continued up into today. Your ability to figure out how to manage around it -- as have numerous Blacks throughout the same time period -- doesn't mean racism is a fiction. Or is that "wishing it into the cornfield' magical-thinking spell part of your sub-group Black Tribe's ideology?

Laniyia wrote: "For me and many others who will never be part of a black nation or tribe there is individuality."

Do I sense the terminology of the 'soveriegn without citizens' group bubbling just under the surface of that comment?

Laniyia wrote: "My opinion is they are history."

Indeed. It IS history, if for no other reason than because such efforts are attacked and stomped out like a fire by the barbaric dominant class, jealously guarding their monopoly of wealth & power. The last one destroyed to my knowledge was Malachi York's township that Wesley Snipes was a part of. The feds cooked up some nonsense about them and set what they didn't steal on fire. The fact that they left the Chinese and Italians alone to build their own interconnected community, economically included into the mainstream without outsider sabotage, is also history. You don't consider it odd that the proposal for Blacks to do the same was vehemently shot down by the power class? I know you have your own expressed opinions as to why the idea is "stupid," but why react the way they did react? You don't think that suspicious?

Laniyia wrote: "I got a loan to start my business."

You saw my long list of financial institutions scamming Blacks. Was the interest rates on your loan comparable to what whites routinely receive, or to what the racist institutions inflicted on the Black people?

Laniyia wrote: "I left because those who i knew that heard i had a idea asked me about it in order to try and steal it and i left because had i built it there i would have been robbed and ruined by that 'tribe.'"

So I gathered from your first mention of your testimony. And I don't blame you, but every people has their criminal element, and of course they concentrate in the poorest neighborhoods. I know you probably overcame some crazy trash during your impressive journey, Laniyia, but it isn't fair to paint the entire ethnic group with the colors you found on the Harlem community's weakest side. Please soften your heart for those who haven't allowed themselves to fall into "the life."

Laniyia Washington - M. Rasheed wrote: "lol That proclamation centers you firmly within a sub-group Black Tribe that I argue with all the time."

A sub group you created by being entirely focused on race not them.

M. Rasheed wrote: "I take it that you have done the following:
1) taken ownership of the concept "surround yourself by the people who are doing what you want to do" or something similar.
2) associate all Black people with ‘poor criminality.’"

I surround myself with (if that is the correct term) people who i enjoy the company of, typically those who have similar interests, personality and character.

And i do not think of any group of people in terms of “all”.

M. Rasheed wrote: "Couldn't you find some successful Black trans-folk to hang out with? Thoughts?"

My thoughts are that you got it bad.

What the hell does me being black or trans tell you about me?

That i was born in a poor area to a single mother, bolstered my education in public libraries was a prostitute in the late 80’s and early 90’s during those violent times and eventually built my own business gives you some idea about my personality.

But even that is only a slight insight.

What the hell does black tranny tell you about me when it tells me nothing about me?

M. Rasheed wrote: "The white/Black dynamic is 100% the racism relationship of whites exploiting Blacks. It's been like that since 1619 and continued up into today."

I am in my 40’s not my 400’s and whatever form today's racism takes is and was irrelevant and powerless to prevent my success.

M. Rasheed wrote: "You saw my long list of financial institutions scamming Blacks. Was the interest rates on your loan comparable to what whites routinely receive, or to what the racist institutions inflicted on the Black people?"

I cannot say what others do but if you think i just walked blindly into the first bank i found and accepted what they offered then you have not been paying attention to the kind of person i am.

But maybe you think cos im black that is what i did.

M. Rasheed wrote: "So I gathered from your first mention of your testimony. [...] Please soften your heart for those who haven't allowed themselves to fall into 'the life.'"

I am painting no entire ethnic groups anything, in all this i have over and over expressed myself as a individual and with a focus on individuality i have also continually dismissed being or seeing myself as part of a tribe or black nation.

You are projecting your racial views and how you delineate by race onto me and my life, the struggles you are having is that i did not live my life along those lines nor do i share that perspective.

Muhammad Rasheed - Laniyia wrote: "A sub group you created by being entirely focused on race not them."

I didn't create the sub-group. A certain group of people happens to share a set of very specific traits that they have in common. The one that recognizes the natural grouping isn't the creator of the group. The people of the group who share those common traits don't HAVE to come together for mutual interest (as you very firmly demonstrate in your own life), but it would seem to be a good idea to do so, since those who do tend to be the most successful.

Laniyia wrote: "And i do not think of any group of people in terms of 'all.'"

Thus far you've given the impression that you have an active dislike for the African-American ethnic group in general, and are trying to distance yourself from them as much as possible. I can fully understand a desire to want to get away from an old neighborhood that held way too many bad memories, but you've expressed something much broader than just that. Does your new company circle hold an anti-Black opinion among them, Laniyia?

Laniyia wrote: "My thoughts are that you got it bad."

lol Probably. To be honest, the more I dig and learn about what's going on within the fabric of Western Society, the more radicalized I FEEL. No doubt I'm projecting that a lot in these dialogues.

Laniyia wrote: "What the hell does me being black or trans tell you about me?"

What else? It tells me you share similar background with a group of others.

Laniyia wrote: "I am in my 40’s not my 400’s and whatever form today's racism takes is and was irrelevant and powerless to prevent my success."

You support an earlier statement of mine, that Blacks have never had a problem building wealth. There were wealthy freemen Blacks during the very heart of the slavery era. The problem is that were it not for racism, MORE Blacks would be wealthy, and poverty would actually be rare. Our wealth has been continuously siphoned off and used to feed the dominant class of our racist aristocracy. My status post is pointing that out, and you've come to refute it using your individual success story. The facts of history demonstrate that you will need something stronger. What do you have?

Laniyia wrote: "But maybe you think cos im black that is what i did."

No. I expected you to do the very best you could with what you had, and even use your ingenuity to pioneer new opportunities. I also expected THAT one to continue the trend of being a racist asshole when he saw that you were Black, and raise your interest rate just because he could, even if it happened to be the best deal you found after shopping around.

Laniyia wrote: "...the struggles you are having is that i did not live my life along those lines nor do i share that perspective."

I'm not struggling, I'm just expressing concepts your way to learn more about how you think from your responses. My goal was to learn why you responded to my status post the way you did by probing more. Just conversation stuff, Laniyia. I certainly appreciate you being game for it, even though you sound like you want to tear my head off sometimes. :D

Fel Rouse - M. Rasheed wrote: “Making my own way along my own path" is the true path of freedom. A very wise statement.

Muhammad Rasheed - Bearing in mind that fighting the oppressive greed of my country’s racist aristocracy is part of that path I’m on. I’m pleased you recognize the wisdom involved. ;)

Fel Rouse - What you seem to be missing is that the “American Civil War 2.0” has been in effect since the end of Reconstruction and we have been losing. Before even attempting a massive action such as the nation-wide boycott you describe, we do have to take what Laniyia Washington offered as a beginning, and that is to clearly see who is exploiting us among our own people. Sadly there are many black churches that do nothing in the communities in which they are situated but hold services on Sundays and special events for their congregations only. The black church is one of the powerful elements black people have control of yet it seems too often ineffective in combatting crime, economic exploitation, political exploitation, and the deprivations that are unique to all economically challenged communities around the country. In addition, the black church has alienated members of our communities who are gay or transgendered with judgements based on a refusal to see life as it is rather than as they believe it should be. There cannot be such divisions if there are to be massive actions against oppression. Self control and refusing to judge others will go a long way to creating a mindset that will begin to remove the stultifying elements that hold so many of us back.

I don’t believe in an American Civil War 2.0 as some apocalyptic event where the population of America begins attacking itself on the basis of race, religion, or economic situation. The reason is other powerful nations, particularly China, would be all too ready to invade and conquer if we became embroiled in a war against each other. I think a lot of people are aware of that possibility. You are an artist and have a creative mind. I look to you and others like you to help create the vision that will inspire many to break past whatever holds them back.

Muhammad Rasheed - Fel wrote: “There cannot be such divisions if there are to be massive actions against oppression.”

Not so, as my list of major gains during key points of African-American history in my response to Laniyia proved. There were ALWAYS such divisions among the Black Nation, since the tribes do not always get along, then as now. Your well-rehearsed complaints about the church sound little different from that of Reconstruction era Black figures like Booker T. Washington. There have always been treacherous, cowardly, and even apathetic Blacks among us every step of the way. Remember the response of then heavyweight boxing champion Sonny Liston when he was asked why he wasn’t lending his own considerable voice to the Civil Rights Movement? Suffice to say it didn’t exactly show him in a favorable light.

Yet, the Black heroes who did take part endured and we won that phase of the war. Where there is a will—and the will is ever among us to be called out—there will be a way.

Fel wrote: “I look to you and others like you to help create the vision that will inspire many to break past whatever holds them back.”

At the moment, I need to create the vision that “no oppressor ever willingly stopped oppressing his victims.” In order to abolish chattel the bloodiest war in America was needed, as there was far too much monetary value within the 4 million slaves at the time to willingly give it up. Today they are still reaping obscene amounts of wealth from us—in far more ways that ever before—and for us to live at our best we will have to make them let us go. It will not be impossible. I am the believing oppressed, and the One God is on my side in this Righteous Fight.

You two should practice more optimism. Freedom is worth it, don’t you think? Not too long ago, a Black President of the United States of America was equally “impossible,” innit? What was done before can be done again.

Black citizens boycott white merchants for U.S. voting rights, Tuskegee, Alabama, 1957-1961

Fel Rouse - Do you know who Paul Robeson was? How about Robert F. Williams?

If your list shows gains you uphold as impressive, what are you doing talking about the need for a nation-wide boycott?

Paul Robeson helped to bring awareness of the world beyond America to black people in America, and he began to create bonds with people in Africa, Asia, and Europe. Various black leaders, the most notably vicious of which was Mr. Roy Wilkins of the NAACP, worked to destroy the reputation and career of Mr. Robeson all in service to a supremacist government that wanted to paint Mr. Robeson as a communist. Those bonds with the people of other nations once called the “Third World” were not maintained.

Robert F. Williams upheld the right to self defense for black Americans in the face of brutal violence by white racists that went unchecked by law. His opposition came from one Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. and his followers, who wanted to raise the banner of nonviolence as the pre-eminent tactic of empowerment for black Americans. He too began to create bonds between people in Cuba and China and black Americans, when he was forced to flee the US on trumped-up kidnapping charges. Where was the outrage of the Civil Rights community for the unfair treatment of these leaders? They are just two examples of the divisions I describe.

How was the original Black Panther Party for Self Defense brought down? Certainly there was the involvement of blacks in its destruction. And what was it doing that was so destructive to America? Feeding under privileged black children. Providing legal services for people of the communities where they were situated. Monitoring police activity in communities where police misconduct and abuse of citizens was rampant.

It’s good that you are on this topic, but it’s not enough. I spent more than half of my life working in black communities here helping to confront challenges and joining efforts to improve conditions, so what I am talking about isn’t coming from what I think but from what I have witnessed. It’s your turn now. By your own standards, based on the future you have described, you have mountains of work to do.

Muhammad Rasheed - The ‘divisions’ you’ve described are no less than the work of the enemy, deliberately sowing mischief and deception within our midst (see: COINTELPRO) to prevent his cash cow from escaping his grasp. Our economic exclusion is his living, breathing ATM, and we need to be fully aware of the lengths he will go through to keep us in an exploitative state. The necessary rock solid defensive position needed to fend off his certain attack—with the exact same desperate, greed-fueled, drooling, maniacal-eyed look on his face as he wore during the Civil War—is what I mean regarding the Civil War 2.0. What drove him to violence before will do so again, and our study of his tactics as you’ve laid out here is a weapon we can use in our planning. #KnowThyEnemy

In reading through history, one of my most frustrated moments come from seeing how often Blacks would nonchalantly turn their backs on the white community after winning through to some momentous civil rights gain, foolishly believing that we didn’t have to VIGILANTLY stand over and protect that which we had won. We can’t afford that mentality anymore, if ever. No matter what, he WILL regroup and attack again, and we MUST be ready for it. Even from among our own skin folk.

Fel Rouse - Agreed. Just understand, there are those who will work just as vehemently as the white community to undermine whatever we do to transcend and overcome the bonds imposed and inflicted on our people, and they ain’t white. Peace.

Muhammad Rasheed - I know. Infiltrating agents have been one of the enemy’s most effective tools, but we can fend against that too if we’re willing. Thank you so much for the discussion.

Peace.

Tuesday, December 26, 2017

The Science of Justifying Wrong


Artist's depiction of the exact amount of energy and thought
that went into using Christianity to justify slavery.

Muhammad Rasheed - [WIKI] “Joseph Smith and Brigham Young reasoned that black skin was a result of the Curse of Cain or the Curse of Ham."

Dafuq kind of 'reasoning' was THAT?

[WIKI] "Joseph Smith founded the movement in Western New York in the 1820s."

Oh, okay. Now it makes sense. That was the typical "reasoning" mindset during slavery.

Zod Hamilton - Thats one of the ways they justified slavery by Christian rules.

Muhammad Rasheed - Christianity had nothing to do with that. They pulled that shit out of their ass FOR the slave institution and pretended it was Christianity. Christian Americans led the fight against slavery at every step of the way, and claptrap similar to what Smith "reasoned" was the counter.

Steve Plater - Exploited Christianity is more like it.

Hall Hall - @M. Rasheed... Let’s not hide the fact that Christianity was used by the slave masters to justify slavery. And to keep the black man turning the other cheek.

Muhammad Rasheed - 1.) The slave owners cheerfully used any and everything to justify keeping their gravy train rolling, while other Christians used their religion to lead the fight against slavery.

2.) The "turn the other cheek" doctrine didn't stop the slaves from revolting in uprisings all the time though. hahaha The slaves knew when people were blowing smoke up their butts.

Obviously the fault isn't with the religion , but with the evil ones who just wanted to enrich themselves at the expense of others.

Ken Peck - This theory predates Smith & Young by several centuries. Yes, it was used to justify slavery. You might be interested in this book: Stamped from the Beginning: The Definitive History of Racist Ideas in America by Ibram X. Kendi 

Muhammad Rasheed - So far I'm having issue with how Kendi is using the word "Muslim." Is he aware that it describes the practitioners of a religion, and not a race? Most of the Arabs are a dark-skinned people.

Muhammad Rasheed - Kendi wrote: "The lineage of this curse of Ham theory curves back through the great Persian scholar Tabari (838-923) all the way to Islamic and Hebrew sources."

The idea of the Curse of Ham from the bible doesn't inflict "blackness" upon the boy. That interpretation of the tale comes from the Talmud, as Kendi references in the above quote, which is interesting for several reasons, not the least of which is that it was the Jews who set up the model for the Atlantic Slave Trade in the first place, and did so with a smooth, and well-practiced fluidity demonstrating that they had been using that method for quite some time.

Muhammad Rasheed - The using of the "Ham's curse" concept -- which never had anything to do with Christianity -- to justify slavery, while the big fight to end slavery was always led by Christians from their own rightly-guided understanding of the bible, means that the fault is with the corrupt and greedy enslavers, not with Christianity.

Ken Peck - Or maybe Martin Luther, who came up with the notion that any idiot could interpret the Bible for himself.

Muhammad Rasheed - I don't see your point in context. The concept of the curse of Ham affliction being 'blackness' came from the Talmud, as the rabbis themselves sought to justify why it was okay to trade in Black bodies. Obviously their Christian trading partners eagerly received the concept from them so they could simultaneously get rich and sleep at night.

Dalet Yasharahla - Refer to Revelations 13:10.

Also Mr. Muhammad feel free to research trans saharah slave trade.

Muhammad Rasheed - Dalet wrote: "Refer to Revelations 13:10." 

So after a string of verses describing the forces of a ruler of evil sowing mischief in the earth, we find Rev 13:10 explaining that the believers of that time will require the patience and faith "of the saints" as the forces of evil will be captured as slaves and killed just as they did to the believers. If this cherry-picked verse was being used to justify the enslavement of Blacks, then that definitely supports my cartoon's message.

Dalet wrote: "Also Mr. Muhammad feel free to research trans saharah slave trade." 

lol I am quite familiar with it. Have you come to make the case that the Arab and/or Muslims also used the bible to justify their own slavery?  ;)  I am open to hear your argument points.

Throw Down Your Rod.

Dalet Yasharahla - The "cherry picked" verse is actually the opposite of your message. What slavery has the Arab or Muslim had? Simply highlighting the fact that the Arab peoples had us in bondage for about 1400 years ±.

Muhammad Rasheed - The verse is saying that the villain who had previously been enslaving and killing would be himself enslaved and killed, and that the believers would have to have faith and patience. That's what it is saying in the context of the chapter.

The Arab world has continued their slavery, after a short time period in the earliest days of Islam in which it almost faded away. It was brought back by greedy men who acted outside of their religion. That's the most important part. To get them to stop the practice, their blood must be spilled, since the greedily corrupt rarely perform righteous deeds to those they oppress on their own initiative.

Chester Erickson - To be fair, these days the most common proponent of human slavery is muslims. But, you never know, Christianity might get back in the game.

Chester Erickson - To be fair, most slaves taken from africa went to South America, and for a longer time too.

Muhammad Rasheed - 1.) Any Muslims practicing slavery do so from the same motivations as everyone else doing it: greed. The revealed scripture of the One God does not encourage the practice at all, so any secondary works making the claim are fictions.

2.) The Western legacy families and their supporters, whose ancestors owned chattel slaves before the Civil War, are still continuing and profiting from the enslavement of Blacks today. They just label it something else now, and justify it from a different angle.

Muhammad Rasheed - I fail to see what the South American part has to do with anything. Your use of "to be fair" implies something is being refuted.

Chester Erickson - Well, you're stating that the slaves went to the US land, right? Well, the vast majority of slaves did not go to US. They went to Brazil. So, don't blame only the US, also blame other places where the slaves were sent.

Chester Erickson - [VIDEO] The Slave Trade In Two Minutes

Muhammad Rasheed - I'm an African-American whose ancestor's on both sides of my parental lines were enslaved in the United States of America, Chester. Are you supposed to be saying that I don't have a right to discuss my own people's history because some other people were going through the same thing? Please confirm.

Chester Erickson - Discuss what you want, but please be all-inclusive in your claims.

Chester Erickson - Bias doesn't fit you well. Dig your drawings, btw :)

Chester Erickson - Essentially, the Dutch slave masters would sell to anyone who was buying. Not only the Americans.

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "Discuss what you want, but please be all-inclusive in your claims."

No. That's not a thing. Your South America comment serves only as an attempt to distract from a topic you are uncomfortable discussing. I'm not Brazilian, Chester. I'm a descendant of the slaves of the USA. I may focus on my own ethnic group in such a discussion as I like.

Fake 'Black Code' conversation rules designed to control how and what I can talk about, that are invented on the fly by a white male, are rejected. Please don't do that again.

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "Essentially, the Dutch slave masters would sell to anyone who was buying. Not only the Americans."

I doubt it since there was a very strong cartel involved, under very strict contracts. Who was allowed to trade was strictly enforced.

Chester Erickson - Those who were buying were in Brazil, Caribbean, and (what would become) the US. That's who the Dutch sold to. In any case, I do agree with your point that slavery is codified in the bible. However, it's true that we see it elsewhere, too.

Muhammad Rasheed - The folk who owned and controlled the lands in the Caribbean and much of South America lived in New England.

Chester Erickson - Hm, you'll have to show proof that New England colonies owned South America. Heck, back then, New England was barely a small theater in the greater wars of England and France. What I've read states that South America was primarily colonized by the Spanish.

Muhammad Rasheed - Not "colonies," but New England families.

Businesses owned those lands, and traded the slaves on Wall Street as stocks, with people owning shares even in Europe.

Chester Erickson - However, this is your meme, so don't feel obligated to reply :) You do good work with your drawings, so I don't want to ruffle your feathers.

Chester Erickson - M. Rasheed wrote: "Businesses owned those lands, and traded the slaves on Wall Street as stocks, with people owning shares even in Europe"

Interesting. As a skeptic, I will investigate the veracity of these statements.

Muhammad Rasheed - The only thing you posted that "ruffled my feathers" was your attempt to control how and what I wanted to discuss. Other than that, I'm always open to dialog as it feeds my art.

Chester Erickson - Well, I was trying to help you avoid cherry picking, but I understand now that your scope was personal (historical) experience. ;)

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "As a skeptic, I will investigate the veracity of these statements."

It seems odd that you weren't already read up on the topic judging solely by the confidence and passion you initially brought to the thread. You seem to have a whole lot of faith in shallow partisan political talking points. lol

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "Well, I was trying to help you avoid cherry picking..."

That wasn't the impression you left on me. I've experienced white men attempting to manipulate the topic of discussion away from uncomfortable truths before. Your "help" actually felt exactly like that.

Muhammad Rasheed - But I do appreciate the attempt to help me though. Good looking out.

Chester Erickson - M. Rasheed wrote: "You seem to have a whole lot of faith in shallow partisan political talking points. lol"

It is wise to not take advantage of someone's politeness.

See you in the funny papers.

Cheers!

Muhammad Rasheed - In the future, you may wish to use a little less "nice-nasty/passive aggressive" when mixing your serving of politeness. It may help with your authenticity attempts.

Chester Erickson - Just so you know, in case we ever interact again, I'm a proponent of equality for all. So, in the case of my future arguments, at least give me that benefit of the doubt, rather than assuming I'm some white man trying to oppress you.

Chester Erickson - I'm a skeptic and an empiricist. I'm afraid you won't get much in the way of emotional reactions from me  :)

Muhammad Rasheed - lol

Chester, in the future, when attempting to engage in conversation with Black people, please do NOT attempt to tell them how and what they are allowed to talk about in an open discussion. It 100% does not come across as if you are a proponent of "equality for all." Just the opposite in fact. I give that advice freely from my heart because I've decided to give you the benefit of the doubt that you didn't really mean to be that way.

Chester Erickson - Hm. Noted. However, I've never had my friends (of various origins) give me such advice in the 50+ years of my life. Perhaps they knew me before judging me. Anyway, thanks for the advice. All things being equal, I'm off to do something else.

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "I'm a skeptic..."

You should be MORE skeptical then. Or at least practice turning the skepticism you do have in directions you aren't used to.

Chester Erickson - M. Rasheed wrote: "Or at least practice turning the skepticism you do have in directions you aren't used to."

Can you provide an example where I didn't use skepticism?

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "Hm. Noted. However, I've never had my friends (of various origins) give me such advice in the 50+ years of my life."

How do you do? I am M. Rasheed. Pleased to meet you.

Chester wrote: "Perhaps they knew me before judging me."

lol I judged you based on how you treated me in this very thread. You may wish to reconsider your usage of a one-size-fits-all approach when you wander outside of your art studio. lol

Chester Erickson - Well, it seems you're back to personal insults. I've got better things to do with my time than listen to that BS. Congrats, though, you successfully moved the goalposts from my OP, for which there is much empirical evidence. Best Regards, Chester.

Muhammad Rasheed - Tell me why you consider that an insult, while not acknowledging the insult you bopped me with, please.

Muhammad Rasheed - I told you I was insulted by your approach, you said no one ever complained of that before, I advised on being more aware that other people are actually different, and you claimed to be insulted by that.

And here I remember you saying something about not being emotional... At least I THINK that was you.

Chester Erickson - It seems my empirically-verifiable OP is what set you off to begin with, based on your initial reply. I've been trying to avoid antagonizing you, but if you refuse to reciprocate, then I'll argue back. Do us all a favor, and google "muslim slavery today in africa". Please report what you find including, if possible, how you found my claim to be false.

Don't get me wrong. I enjoy your work. It's edgy. But I can live without it.

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "Can you provide an example where I didn't use skepticism?"

Yes. Please note the following items:

1.) Someone told you one must be "all-inclusive in your claims" when engaging in discussions.

2.) Someone told you that "Dutch slave masters would sell to anyone who was buying."

3.) Someone told you that "Those who were buying were in Brazil, Caribbean, and (what would become) the US. That's who the Dutch sold to."

4.) Someone told you (regarding the slave trade) that "back then, New England was barely a small theater."

All of these bullets are verifiably false. Were you to have practiced more precision while wielding your proud skepticism, it may have avoided you proudly and confidently proclaiming these as truths for the public record.

Chester Erickson - M. Rasheed wrote: "2.) Someone told you that 'Dutch slave masters would sell to anyone who was buying.'"

And they would, in the three areas I stated.

Chester Erickson - M. Rasheed wrote: "3.) Someone told you that 'Those who were buying were in Brazil, Caribbean, and (what would become) the US. That's who the Dutch sold to.'"

Yep, that's true.

Chester Erickson - M. Rasheed wrote: "4.) Someone told you (regarding the slave trade) that 'back then, New England was barely a small theater.'"

Yep, the US Revolution was funded by the French. Our troops were trained by the French. The French provided food and supplies.

Chester Erickson - So, I suggest you brush up on history, smart guy.

Chester Erickson - Now, back to my statement about muslim slavery. Would you care to get back to the subject of the OP?

Chester Erickson - Here, let me help you:

https://www.google.com/search... muslim+slavery+today+in+africa

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "It seems my empirically-verifiable OP is what set you off to begin with, based on your initial reply."

I told you the part that upset me. It was the part when you started trying to tell me what I could talk about, that I HAD to include South America in my discourse (or get an "F"?)

Chester wrote: "I've been trying to avoid antagonizing you..."

If that were true, then you would have simply apologized once I told you what the antagonizing issue actually was.

Chester wrote: "...but if you refuse to reciprocate, then I'll argue back."

Active debate is the raw goo I draw from for my art, Chester. It's fine. If you're game (and have the time) then so do I. I always have an open slot for new regulars with different POVs.

Chester wrote: "Do us all a favor, and google "muslim slavery today in africa". Please report what you find including, if possible, how you found my claim to be false."

I addressed that in the two-point post below it. Please tell me why you don't consider it a good enough counter. Wait, is it because it didn't reference South America?  *snort*

Chester wrote: "Don't get me wrong. I enjoy your work. It's edgy. But I can live without it."

This comment is out of place here, and unworthy of you. Please stop saying that kind of stuff. Thank you for your earlier compliments, but now it's getting weird and sounding kind of "threat-like."

Chester Erickson - So, regarding your meme, yes, Christians did use the bible to justify slavery. However, muslims are somehow justifying slavery, and the problem is happening *NOW* to real people alive today. So, cheers, to your drawing - you got part of it right. I wonder if you'll put out a drawing showing the other part.

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "So, regarding your meme, yes, Christians did use the bible to justify slavery."

The point of the cartoon is to show that there was no real effort in using the bible to justify slavery. The greedy just said whatever and did it because they wanted to. The cartoon is actually a defense of the Christian religion itself regarding the slave trade. The Qur'an wasn't used to justify slavery either, because it doesn't.

Greedy men did greedy stuff is the message. The religions themselves are clean, especially in Islam's case.

Chester Erickson - So you're really going to try denying that slavery has been a part of Islam since at least the 8th century AD? It's still going on today, man. It doesn't matter what the prophet says. It doesn't matter what Allah said. They're *doing it right now*. And, I guess the ultimate question is.. who is going to stop them?

Chester Erickson - I guess I could make the same argument, then, that it was just bad men trading slaves in the US. It wasn't that they were Christian.

Chester Erickson - And, of course you know that slavery is mentioned many times in the Qur'an.

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "So you're really going to try denying that slavery has been a part of Islam since at least the 8th century AD?"

Yes. It was actually almost wiped out in the early years because of how it is described in the Qur'an. But it was brought back because of greed. By default that means it was never of the religion, but of the greedy men upholding the economic institution of it.

Chester wrote: "It's still going on today, man."

So?

Chester wrote: "It doesn't matter what the prophet says."

lol Of COURSE it matters.

Chester wrote: "It doesn't matter what Allah said."

Of COURSE it matters what God says. Do you hear yourself?

Chester wrote: "They're *doing it right now*."

Greedy men do a lot of shit outside of the ideals they are supposed to be following on paper. That's not a slight against the ideals, but against them.

Chester wrote: "And, I guess the ultimate question is.. who is going to stop them?"

Slavery has been around almost as long as humans have. At this point it should be obvious that it isn't going anywhere. It's too profitable.

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "I guess I could make the same argument, then, that it was just bad men trading slaves in the US. It wasn't that they were Christian."

That's actually MY argument, and the central message of the cartoon.

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "And, of course you know that slavery is mentioned many times in the Qur'an."

lol If you're supposed to be implying that someone told you that all of those mentions were somehow pro-slavery, then you may add that bullet to the list of faux-factoids that you should've been skeptical of when you first heard them.

Chester Erickson - Hm, seems to me the message is that they are Christians who use Christianity to justify slavery, while making a profit.

Chester Erickson - Don't play coy, Muhammad. You've read the verses. You know they're not anti-slavery. Don't be deceitful.

Muhammad Rasheed - It was the flip "it's in the bible or whatever" that was the punchline. Obviously he didn't do any research into it; he was just saying shit to hurry up and get back to counting his trafficking loot.

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester, I read the verses and that's why I can confidently say what I said. I know my Book, and the message of Allah.

Muhammad Rasheed - That's why I am Muslim.

Chester Erickson - 24:32... this verse is anti-slavery?

Muhammad Rasheed - *sighhh*

Chester Erickson - 16:75... this one is anti-slavery?

Muhammad Rasheed - So which site are you pulling these from? AnsweringIslam? AnsweringMuslims?

Muhammad Rasheed - lol

Okay, stand by...

Chester Erickson - just answer the question. are those verses anti-slavery?

Muhammad Rasheed - Hold on, I'm looking them up. Loading...

Chester Erickson - you don't know them off the top of your head?

Muhammad Rasheed - No. What am I?  The Rain-Man? That's why God created the Internet. lol

Chester Erickson - No, man. Al Gore created the internet ;)

Muhammad Rasheed - (who created him though? And all the parts to make it? c'mon now)

Chester Erickson - oh no, it's an abiogenesis debate :D this'll go nowhere fast ;)

Muhammad Rasheed -
The Holy Qur'an 24:32 -- Marry those among you who are single or the virtuous ones among your slaves male or female: if they are in poverty Allah will give them means out of His grace: for Allah encompasseth all and He knoweth all things.
Chester Erickson - Ok, now... is that verse anti-slavery?

Chester Erickson - Or, does it passively condone it?

Muhammad Rasheed -
The Holy Qur'an 16:75 -- Allah sets forth the Parable of two men: one a slave under the dominion of another; He has no power of any sort; and the other a man on whom We have bestowed goodly favours from Ourselves, and he spends thereof freely, privately and publicly: are the two equal? By no means; praise be to Allah. But most of them understand not.
Chester Erickson - Same question as with last verse... is it anti-slavery?

Muhammad Rasheed - Both verses acknowledge that slavery is going on in that society at the time of revelation. Neither is actively encouraging slavery. The latter one is just using the concept of 'slave' in an allegorical point, while the former tells the believers who they are allowed to marry to protect their virtue. Naturally if you marry a slave, there's a very high chance you'll end up freeing him/her.

Muhammad Rasheed - Any others?

Muhammad Rasheed - Don't be shy.

Chester Erickson - You didn't answer my question at all. Are the verses anti-slavery?

Chester Erickson - It's a simple yes/no answer.

Chester Erickson - No flourish required.

Muhammad Rasheed - No, they are not anti-slavery because that isn't the point of those two verses.

Chester Erickson - At any point in the Qur'an, is an anti-slavery sentiment proposed?

Muhammad Rasheed - Neither of those verses are about the institution or practice of slavery itself. They don't represent 'slave commands" or anything like that. What else do you have more in line to the point you're trying to force?

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "At any point in the Qur'an, is an anti-slavery sentiment proposed?"

Yup. In fact, I was expecting you to post one.

Chester Erickson - You seem to want to avoid accepting the idea that verses from the quran can be interpreted to condone slavery, and that it's happening right now in the real world.

Muhammad Rasheed - I actually thought you were going to spam me with every single Qur'anic slavery mentions like the trolls always do.

Chester Erickson - No reason to do that. My point is made.

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "...that verses from the quran can be interpreted to condone slavery..."

This is also unworthy of you. The message is clear. If someone wants to twist the message to shoehorn their greed into it, that is not a slight against the Book. You know better.

Chester Erickson - Your reply, so far, to the concept of slavery has been:

"Slavery has been around almost as long as humans have. At this point it should be obvious that it isn't going anywhere. It's too profitable."

While that view is rational, it should not be the goal of humanity to passively accept slavery.

Muhammad Rasheed - 1.) The Qur'an says XYZ
2.) Greedy men do ABC
3.) Non-Muslims: "AH HA!! The Qur'an says ABC because look at THOSE guys!!!"

Is this really how you want to leave this conversation? hahaha

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester wrote: "Your reply, so far, to the concept of slavery has been"

Well, to be fair, my ethnic group is still being enslaved today under a different label, and the same old families and the aristocracy built around it, are still profiting from it at my expense. The last time "humanity" actively tried to stop it resulted in the bloodiest war in American history, followed by a century of terror against my people that ultimately returned us to the shackles in a police state.

I am under no illusions that to free us from slavery will result in an even bloodier war that will last much longer.

Chester Erickson - Regardless of your emotional plea, that does not change the fact that humanity should strive for something better than living in the past. Slavery, at a global level, needs to be abolished.

Muhammad Rasheed - You're very brave to say such a thing after the nature of my "emotional plea." lol

Muhammad Rasheed - Basically, there's too much money involved for it not to take a war to stop it.

Muhammad Rasheed - A global war.

Chester Erickson - Perhaps so. When the alternative is enslavement of others, then it's worth it. However, there are other ways to pursue equality.

Chester Erickson - Personally I believe that we as a species should strive to expand to other worlds and moons, and space. This would be a much more productive use of our time, rather than focusing on the past.

Muhammad Rasheed - "Equality" is the next step after slavery is abolished (again).

Chester Erickson - Equality will only come once more things than slavery are abolished. But, yes, slavery is one of those things.

Muhammad Rasheed - Expand to other worlds and moons, and space while we are still in the process of fucking up this planet? Do you hear yourself? lol

So you're saying we SHOULDN'T finally learn from the lessons of the past to improve, but instead should infest the rest of the solar system with our craziness like the virus Agent Smith described?

Muhammad Rasheed - wow...

Muhammad Rasheed - Remind me not to vote YOU in as POTUS.

Stick to cartooning.

Chester Erickson - Ah, therein lies a difference. I believe that the act of expansion will help us figure out how not to fuck things up. Perhaps give people the space between us we need. And, also prevent an "all eggs in one basket" scenario.

Chester Erickson - "lessons of the past" is not the same as "baggage of the past"

Muhammad Rasheed - Chester Erickson wrote: "Ah, therein lies a difference. I believe that the act of expansion will help make the corporations and politicians richer."

*fixed*

Muhammad Rasheed - It's only "baggage" if you never learn from it and improve. If you learn from and become better then it is just the archive of lessons learned.

Chester Erickson - Do you hate the wealthy?

Muhammad Rasheed - What do you mean?

Chester Erickson - M. Rasheed wrote: "I believe that the act of expansion will help make the corporations and politicians richer."

^this.

Muhammad Rasheed - The legacy families that currently compose the 1% are my active enemy in the earth. Those are the descendants and support class of my enslavers.

Muhammad Rasheed - Fuck yeah I hate them.

Muhammad Rasheed - If we "expanded into space" today, it would literally do nothing but make them richer while they gave themselves more tax cuts.

Chester Erickson - Personally, I'm fine with wealth. I'm not fine with people who use their wealth to abuse others.

Muhammad Rasheed - And that's my stance, too.

Muhammad Rasheed - I don't have a problem with wealth building and wealth builders as a concept. it's THOSE assholes who are my problem.

Muhammad Rasheed - Who have been my problem for the last 500 yrs.

Chester Erickson - Who cares if they get tax cuts? Once we get away from Earth the rules mean nothing. Life will become a hardship, but a *chosen* hardship with the potential of meaning.

Muhammad Rasheed - You read a lot of Jack Vance and Roddenberry...

Muhammad Rasheed - The reality will not match up to your fav sci-fi novels, Chester.

Muhammad Rasheed - Certainly not for me.

Chester Erickson - lol... roddenberry, sure. Yes, it's true that at first the connections to Earth will remain, but over time they will fade.

Chester Erickson - The distances will become too great for a central command structure.

Muhammad Rasheed - Groups of wealthy white men with no "central command structure" rules, on uncharted wilderness...

...and me.

>:(

Forgive me if that concept doesn't make me feel warm & fuzzy.

Muhammad Rasheed - You're gonna hafta get googoo-eyed over that fantasy by yourself, chief.  >:(

Muhammad Rasheed - *Been There; Done That*

Chester Erickson - the various directions in which humanity travels in space will become ring species, unable to breed and adapted to their respective environments.

Muhammad Rasheed - (i'll launch the damn nukes myself if i have to)

Muhammad Rasheed - Yeah, but WAAAYYYY before we get to the "ring species" part, my people will be forced to relive chattel slavery 3.0.  >:(

Chester Erickson - Nah, even though the recent past has been rough, the overall experience of Civilization is a success. Personally, I don't think it's the responsibility of this generation to choose to destroy it.

Muhammad Rasheed - Uncharted wilderness doesn't plant cash crops by itself, you know?

Chester Erickson - M. Rasheed wrote: "my people will be forced to relive chattel slavery 3.0"

We *ALL* will.

Muhammad Rasheed - The "promise to the white working class" will ensure that it won't be you.

Unless I get my hands on the keys to SkyNet or whatever.

Chester Erickson - It's not about profit. It's about survival of this thing we call life.

Muhammad Rasheed - Dude.

It's ALWAYS about profits. That's is the heart & soul of western civilization.

Profits.

Muhammad Rasheed - Massive profits for the aristocracy.

Chester Erickson - Hey... have you ever seen Charlie Chaplain's "The Great Dictator"?

Muhammad Rasheed - Nah. Just clips over the years.

Muhammad Rasheed - I'm guessing there's an expansion into space in it? Since you've kinda turned into a one-trick pony now.

Chester Erickson - I am an evangelical for space exploration, yes lol.

Muhammad Rasheed - hahahaha

Chester Erickson - You've probably seen the speech at the end?

Muhammad Rasheed - Not since the '90s...

Chester Erickson - But, no, the speech tells a "different way" to all the people within earshot.

Chester Erickson - Well, there are three options there. Let them win, global war, or get away from them... into space.

Muhammad Rasheed - You're very naive on this item, particularly in your efforts to sell it to an African-American.

Muhammad Rasheed - lol

Muhammad Rasheed - Let me break your proposed options down for you...

Chester Erickson - To me, the speech is inspiring. I'll post a video: [VIDEO] The Greatest Speech Ever Made

Muhammad Rasheed - 1.) LET THEM WIN
This is what Trump's reign is leading to. A return to some kind of Old World serfdom shit. Letting them win will be the destruction of the American Experiment, and a return to old forms of oppressive government.

2.) GLOBAL WAR
This is the only way to stop #1 from continuing at it's current direction. Since it's the only way, it is my preferred option personally.

3.) ...OR GET AWAY FROM THEM... INTO SPACE
Are you insane? Who's going into space? The wealthy will have the equipment built, a class of space explorers will be cast, and a cast of bondsmen to do the work the Explorer Class doesn't want to do, just like in the slave era! I'm NOT going back, Chester! I'll tear ALLL this shit up first. You can go by yourself and be a space explorer of YOU. Maybe take your dog.

Chester Erickson - The effort to develop the technology to easily move humans into space will keep us extremely busy, and away from war. That effort, by the way, has already begun.

Muhammad Rasheed - I've seen stuff with private corporations making their own space exploration efforts. I believe one was called "Dutch East Martian Trading Company" or something similar. I'll have to look it up.  >:(

Chester Erickson - SpaceX and Virgin Galactic are also working on such plans.

Muhammad Rasheed - [WIKI] Dutch East India Company 

Chester Erickson - LOL. Yeah, wouldn't surprise me to see new companies pop up like that. At least for a while.

Muhammad Rasheed - dude... >:(

Chester Erickson - Not saying I agree with them. Just saying.. yeah, you would probably be right.

Chester Erickson - And there would also be *honest* corps you can work for.

Chester Erickson - And don't forget about the robots who can already do a lot of work for humans. Their functionality will only improve in an expanding society.

Muhammad Rasheed - They will also be expensive.

Muhammad Rasheed - Will it be cheaper to build a bunch of robots, or throw Black people back in chains?

Muhammad Rasheed -    ......................

Muhammad Rasheed - *joins NRA*

Chester Erickson - Probably not so expensive, once they standardize. And cheap to replace, without all of those ethical quandaries associated with slavery. They also work 24x7x365.

Muhammad Rasheed - They also wear out and require regular maintenance. Also expensive.

Muhammad Rasheed - I'm not going to pick cotton on Ganymede, Chester. #FightMe

Muhammad Rasheed -  >:(

Chester Erickson - Let's say a robot costs $1M and they last 10 years. That's not too far off from a human salary.

Chester Erickson - I could calculate the hourly rate, too, but I'm afraid humans won't come out too well there, either.

Chester Erickson - So, we humans are going to need something to do... guess what I would suggest...  ;)

Muhammad Rasheed - That's a whole lot of wishy-washy-iffy guess work about robots when they know for a fact how much slaves cost and they are currently 100% fine with slave labor.  >:(

Muhammad Rasheed - Them and all of their overseas buddies.  >:(

Muhammad Rasheed - I'll watch the Chaplin clip you linked to if you watch the 13th documentary by Ava DuVernay.

Chester Erickson - It's only iffy because there are variables in the model, as there should be. We already have companies selling robots for manufacturing, and we've also got humanoid robots helping out on the ISS, so models and pipelines for sales and manufacturing have been worked out.

Muhammad Rasheed - I KNOW why it's iffy! That's why the very first thing they'll reach for is ME while they tinker with their R2 units.  >:(

Chester Erickson - Hm... I'll watch it, but I suspect I've already seen much of the content. Deal!

Muhammad Rasheed - Let me know when you're done. We'll meet back here and make fun of each other's suggestion.

Chester Erickson - To be honest, my wife and I are about to do something for a few hours. But - we'll watch it and let you know later tonight.

Muhammad Rasheed - I didn't mean TODAY. Just let me know when you do.

Muhammad Rasheed - (tmi btw)

Chester Erickson -


Sunday, December 24, 2017

The Coward's Game of 'Respectability Politics'


Muhammad Rasheed - My personal definition of "Respectability Politics."

I think it ultimately boils down to a high-level form of cooning, which is itself a pathetic and cowardly acknowledgement that “white people won, y’all” and we should just accept it and make the best of our lives well inside of the lines whites have arbitrarily drawn for us.

Respectability politics is basically a contest between coons, as they try to outdo each other in acting the way they think whites want them to act, dressing the way they think whites want them to dress, and promoting the ideologies they think that whites prefer them to promote, so that if they do a great job, whites will choose them to be that company’s “token black.” The ultimate goal is to have the most racist whites say, “Now THAT’S a black that I wouldn’t mind voting for!”

The practitioners of respectability politics earnestly believe that whites are crazy and that they will never stop exploiting us, but they think Blacks may experience less foulness and abuse from whites if we all agree to coon in this way. These Blacks think that ‘racism’ is our fault for angrily responding to racist actions of whites instead of just “forgiving” whites of their never-ending abuses and letting it go. They don’t believe Blacks should spend any effort in activism, or otherwise making whites feel uncomfortable, because it may make the respectability politics track more difficult as whites will just get defensive and angry and now they don’t want ANY Blacks in their company. This frustrates the high-level coon, and ironically makes them feel like it's the activists who are regressive in the race relations game.

Joe Engesser - Make America Separate Again?

Muhammad Rasheed - "again?"

Gil Harris - @M. Rasheed... so every conservative black man is what? A bad person? A traitor? An Uncle Tom? Betcha more conservative black men have intact families than lefties, BLMs and the like

Muhammad Rasheed - @Gil... Well, I did toss a blue tie in there to show that it wasn't an exclusively partisan item. Even though Black Republicans do tend to be the most ridiculously caricatured in this role, it is a Black politician thing almost across the board. Conspicuously, there's no "African-American Political Agenda" to hold the Black politician class accountable, so they are forced to align themselves to the platform of interests other than that of their own ethnic group in order to have a career. Consequently, the Black politician tends to be a sell-out figure by default, and will continue to be one (with one notable exception) until the Black community as a whole becomes more politically savvy and learns to get their elected officials in line using their vote and economic force.

Gil wrote: "Betcha more conservative black men have intact families..."

I don't see what that political talking point has to do with the topic, but you have raised an interesting concept I'd never thought about before. The idea that, as a reward for becoming a willing support class under whites in the GOP, Blacks will receive a respite from the 1%'s never-ending war against the Black Family and some token of material success within the conservative machine. That's certainly worth exploring in the data. Thanks, Gil.

Gil Harris - Not sure if you're having a sincere discussion or not---but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. You said. ".........The idea that, as a reward for becoming a willing support class under whites in the GOP, Blacks will receive a respite from the never-ending war against the Black Family...." both clauses are truth deprived---but the "never ending war against the black family?" puleeeeeze--- How about some black responsibility for the demise of the black family?

Muhammad Rasheed - The respite from that attack was my own speculation based on you oddly tossing in that "intact family" thing when it had nothing to do with the topic of discussion. I figured you were letting something slip you weren't supposed to be admitting to while thinking you were being clever about it. Now that you've been called out, I wouldn't expect you to tell the truth now anyway, so we may as well let that go. lol

The war against the Black Family is very real, as documented in Moynihan's infamous report. Plus it's a no-brainer based on what it's designed to do, and who traditionally profits from stuff like that.